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Rebuttal of "Fact" 8

Page history last edited by Chinagirl 12 years, 10 months ago Saved with comment

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8. Instead of looking for Madeleine, two friends of the McCanns tore off the cover of Madeleine’s Activity Sticker Book, writing down what they claimed was a record of the night’s events. They then wrote out a second timeline of what they said happened. In both versions, they said Jane Tanner had seen an abductor around 9.15pm. But she did not tell the McCanns what she had seen for 24 hours.


Verdict - False and Misleading.  They had looked for her. The police wanted them to give a record of a timeline.When Jane Tanner told the police (PJ) about what she had seen, Gerry was present. It's true she hadn't directly talked to Kate and Gerry about it. 

Sources - U.S. Department of Justice publication and police files


When Your Child Is Missing: A Family Survival Guide:

Give law enforcement investigators all the facts and circumstances related to the disappearance of your child, including what efforts have already been made to search for your child.





Summary of Verifiable Facts


  1. When the friends returned to the apartment after searching, the police were there. They (the PJ) told Russell O'Brien that what he was doing (writing down in keywords the crucial events of that evening) was what they wanted, needed.
  2. When Jane Tanner told the PJ about seeing a man carrying a child, Gerry was present. Both Gerry and Kate mentioned what she saw in their statements on May 4.



Extracts from the files, with relevant portions highlighted in red


Rogatory interview Russell O'Brien 10 April 2008 8.59am


The next, so, at some point I think I felt, I was starting to feel sort of useless again, just hanging around the apartment, there were a lot of people, going around at this point, so I opted, after the pictures and after a period of time back in the flat and conversations to go away again, and this time I searched over and on towards the Millennium Restaurant, so in a, in a completely different direction to where I had been before. (..)


The, the next real recollection, I mean, I don't know how much time we spent in our own flats and talking outside, but the next recollection really is, being in the, in the flat, this was sort the first time I remember being in the flat with, with, with, with Gerry, around this point there, there were a lot more, I think, I think the PJ had arrived and certainly there were actually other, other members of the GNR around as well because there was, a fair number of people milling around in the, in the passageway going in through the, the, the locked door, not, so not on the patio side, but there were a lot of people including Police around, around the exit there near the shutters and stuff. And at some stage sort of quietened off and the, the PJ sat down with, came in and sat down with Gerry, the recollections of what happened there are relatively dim now, but the only ones I can really recall was, although it was prompted by what you showed me on Tuesday, was that we were writing on the back of a piece of card, I thought it was a cereal box but obviously it was a children's book, a very kind of, very, very, draft idea of what happened in the hour and, and what state the windows and the shutters had been in and I think I, that was, that was written with me sat at the table in Kate and Gerry's room. Gerry by this point had certainly calmed down but was, his head was just on the table, like that, he was just staring at the, at the table, very, very quiet and very, very low. Dave PAYNE was in there at least at one point early on.

And I think possibly Sylvia this Housekeeper, I think she came in, I think she was offering to translate at some point. But anyway Dave PAYNE said to, there were two members of the PJ had arrived, there was a guy I remember being almost shaved bald head, quite dark complexion, and a second one who we kind of nicknamed 'baby face' who did our fingerprinting about a week later, and those two were there and Dave was, was saying, 'Shouldn't we', 'Why are we sitting here, shouldn't you be on the radio, shouldn't there be more people here, shouldn't there be', 'this should be on the radio, it should be on the television' and, I recall 'baby face' or his colleague saying 'No media', and, and that was full-stop and then turning round to me writing the timeline and saying 'That's what we want', fair enough. And that's really it. At some point Jane came in, I think because Jane was in with our kids at this point, I didn't hang around too, too long and I went out, but Jane came in I think to give a brief statement to the, the, the PJ on the night, and this is where she's concerned that, she didn't really want to believe what she had seen and she was worried that she had played it down to those staff on the, on the night, such that, that she was never taken seriously again by the PJ, that was, that, I mean, that was, her concern about how she, how she pitched it at the time, but she desperately didn't want to believe that what she saw was, was true and be the last person, in the group to sort of see Madeleine.



Witness statement of Gerald Patrick McCann, on the 4th of May 2007, at 11.15 a.m.


It is emphasised that one of the members of the group, Jane, at about 21.10 - 21.15 when she was going to her apartment to check on her children, she saw from the back, at a distance of about 50 metres, on the road bordering the club, an individual carrying a child, wearing pyjamas, Jane will be able to clarify this situation.



Witness statement of Kate Marie Healy, on the 4th of May 2007, at 2.20 p.m


Later, a member of the group, Russell's partner Jane, when she went to her apartment to see her children at around 9.15pm, saw from the back [rear] about 50 metres away, on the perimeter road of the club, a long-haired person, in what she thinks were jeans, with a child in his arms and walking very quickly. But she is better able to tell you about that herself.



Witness statement of Jane Michelle Tanner on the 4th of May 2007, at 11:30 a.m.


As regards these details, she does not know what Madeleine was wearing at the moment of her disappearance, because she did not talk to anyone about this. As she concerns the man she saw, she only spoke to Gerald about this, not entering into details, and to the police.



Rogatory interview Jane Tanner 8 April 2008 10.00 am


4078 "What about Russell (inaudible)?"
Reply "Well him and Matt they were doing the, they were, I think they were sort of searching, I don't know where they searched, but they, they were actually sort of running around actually looking farther afield, so didn't really see them much at all. I think that they did come back and as I say I can't remember when they came back but I remember them coming back and then they went off again. And then I think they, Russell was there when I spoke to the PJ, because I can remember Russell coming in with me when I spoke to the PJ, because there was Russell and Gerry was there as well in the apartment when I spoke to the PJ. And that was the first time I'd ever been into their, into Kate and Gerry's apartment through the whole week, I hadn't, it might seem like, but we hadn't really been into their apartment before".

01.04.52 4078 "Sorry, was that on the night that Madeleine had disappeared?"
Reply "That was at three o'clock in the morning after she'd disappeared, yeah".
4078 "Okay. Well tell me about that part then, how did you come to go into Gerry and Kate's apartment?"
Reply "Well when the GNR people came, so the first lot of Police, the local Police came, I spoke to them and I think that was through the translator, which was, I think she's called Sylvie, she's the Head of Housekeeping or something, she was doing the translating at that point. So I'd spoken to the GNR Police and then when the PJ came, they came to get me to talk to them to say, to say what, what I'd seen. And then I can remember the same GNR person saying to me later on in the night 'Oh have you spoken to the PJ' and I had by that stage, so".
4078 "So when you went into Gerry and Kate's apartment who else was there?"
Reply "I think there was Russ, I think Russell came with me and there was Sylvie who was the translator. I can't remember which, there was some, there was a PJ chap was sitting on the, by the table. And there was Gerry who was standing by the, the bedroom door".
4078 "And how was Gerry at that point?"
Reply "Oh he was just, well obviously, obviously distraught. And I think it was quite hard for me to be saying at that, looking in his face and to be explaining what I'd seen, at that point was quite hard because, Gerry was obviously standing there, I don't know whether, and you sort of think 'Oh God, here's me, if I'd tried to stop them this wouldn't have happened' sort of thing. So I think I did feel sort of a bit obviously guilty at that stage even though I didn't know whether it was anything, but obviously you think 'Oh blo*dy hell, what if I', not stopped it happened potentially".
01.06.30 4078 "And what was Gerry's reaction to what you said?"
Reply "Well I don't even know whether he took it in, I mean, he was just, he was, obviously just standing there looking absolutely horrified, so".
4078 "And where was Kate?"
Reply "I don't know at that point, she wasn't, she wasn't in the, she wasn't there. I don't know whether, I think they had taken the twins out of the room by that stage, so I don't know whether she was up in Dave and Fi's room".


4078 "Okay. When was the next time you saw Kate?"
Reply "The next morning when we were being picked up by the PJ to be taken into, for the, for questioning. They had gone up into, Dave and Fi, well decamped up to Dave and Fi's room. There was lots of people running about and it was almost like, I'll just, not keep out of the way, but, it was almost like, we didn't feel we could, not we didn't feel we could go up there, but it was almost like, I don't know how to put it into words, but, you just sort of, I don't know how to say this, it almost sounds like we were keeping out of the way. which is not what I'm saying at all, but, they were so distraught, it was how do you talk to somebody like that, especially because we don't know them that well, so they're closest to Dave and Fi, so we almost like left Dave and Fi, to cope with the emotional side of it, I suppose, is the best way of putting it. And, again, you think I would be going 'Oh I've seen somebody, I've seen somebody', but I've told the PJ, and the thought of standing there and talking to Kate about what I've seen is just too horrible to, think about at that stage. So, that's, that's why I hadn't talked directly to them at that stage".



Compare MMRG Claim with the Facts:


MMRG quote: Instead of looking for Madeleine, two friends of the McCanns tore off the cover of Madeleine’s activity sticker book, writing down what they claimed was a record of the night’s events.


Actually: They had been searching for her. When the police arrived they said they needed the information. 



MMRG quote: Jane Tanner did not tell the McCanns what she had seen for 24 hours.


Actually: When Jane told the PJ about what she'd seen, Gerry was present. As we can read in the McCann's statements of 4 May, they both knew about it even though Jane hadn't talked directly to them about  it.








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